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General Discussions / Re: Extra Curricular Activities Defined?
« Last post by BMull on August 06, 2019, 10:54:24 PM »
Hello.  Honestly, it wouldn't matter if this were a hobby or an extracurricular activity.  It is well documented with the court and the committee meeting minutes that the tables used to derive the parental child support obligations are inclusive of every conceivable expense for a family.  When a parent is "residential" or "custodial" they receive all the money for all these expenses and they are expected to pay for them using child support money.

It is a common misconception that a child should be able to be supported on child support.  This narrative is completely false.  Kansas is an income shares state which puts a financial obligation on each parent to pay their respective share of the expenses.  So the child support payment only represents the father's portion.  Mother also needs to contribute.

My personal opinion is that cheer is absolutely an extracurricular activity.  Terming it a "hobby" is tomato/tomoto.  Cheerleading is practiced in schools. Just because you decide to spend $1k or more per month for competitive cheer doesn't make it a hobby.  But, to my previous point - it doesn't matter what you call it.

While I sat on the advisory committee I was in the room when a similar question was asked of the state economist.  It was concluded that families who elect to spend enormous amounts on frivolous activities simply take away from other activities (and potentially needs).  This would be the case with married families - there's no reason to provide additional advantages to children of separated families.  If it can't be afforded in a married family, it can't be afforded by a separated family.

A little blunt, but that's my opinion.
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General Discussions / Extra Curricular Activities Defined?
« Last post by GetAKitty on July 29, 2019, 01:41:43 PM »
A friend of mine became divorced from her husband 18 months ago, ending a 20 year marriage.  The divorce decree says that she is to pay for the kids? extracurricular activities out of the child support the husband pays her each month.  The daughter participates in competitive cheerleading and the mother has been paying 100% of the expenses since last year because the ex-husband said that it was an extracurricular activity.  I don?t agree that it is.  It is not related to any school activity and I view this more as a ?hobby? or activity that the daughter does.  So my question is, in your opinion, is the activity ?extracurricular? or is it more likely that the husband simply told the wife that it was to get her to pay for it from the child support.  They were divorced in Johnson County.
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Firstly the long distance adjustment and the overall financial condition adjustment are discretionary with the court.  The Judge will need to approve the amount, but you are correct that if you'd like to formally request that credit, this is the box you want to put it in.  From the sounds of it, the distance adjustment would be applicable to your case.  The overall financial condition adjustment is more for considerations that fall outside of any other section of the guidelines.  One such condition might be that you require therapy or special education to cope with your learning disability which absorbs a lot of your income.  In such a case, the Judge could allow your requested adjustment (or make changes to it).

To calculate the amount, you would itemize all the costs to exercise parenting time (such as airfare costs and lodging).  Then multiply that by how many times you'd be traveling to see the kids over the course of a year and divide by 12 to arrive at the monthly amount.

It is possible the Judge could reject your proposal if you voluntarily moved to TX and there was no agreement to this move.  However, if the move was for work or to have family support, or possibly the move was already in the plan before the divorce, a Judge might allow it.  In my opinion there is no harm in requesting the adjustment.  The judge could allow it or not.  It's probably worth at least asking and making your case.
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Im doing my child support worksheet and there are places for Long distance parenting time adjustments and parenting time adjustment overall financial condition. On my exs child support worksheet he didnt out anything however I live in texas now and him in kansas he wont help get me up to see my kids or help bribg them to me. Its costs roughly $800 to $1000 to go hone to see my kids for 1 week in kansas since he wont let me take them out of state till after divorce is final. I eat this expense. What amount would I put there in that spot I pay this about 5 tomes per year. But thats all I get to spend with them. They never get to come to my house. Its always in a motel. He stopped paying my alimony I had been getting for two years not court ordered making me contest our divorce to get it back. Now im stuck representing myself and its not easy to understand all this forms. Specially with a learning disability. Can anyobe explain to me how much or how to figure this amounts for adjustments.
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I completely agree.  Here's my feedback.

Guidelines - abiding by the guidelines is actually state law.  A judge must make specific findings of fact in order to deviate from the guidelines.  The guidelines are derived from the Consumer Expenditure Survey data conducted by the Bureau of Labor and Statistics.  If things are getting made up, the orders can likely be appealed to the KS Court of Appeals and to the Supreme Court.

Troubled opposing parties - firstly, requesting attorney fees is pretty standard practice.  They all request fees just in case.  Actually you should be the one requesting attorney fees if the motion is frivolous and without merit. All of your motions should request attorney fees.  I rarely see attorney fees being awarded.

All parties have a right to due process.  I can only speak from experience, but I have had great luck with returning the favor.  As an example I was faced with a subpoena against my income and all my employment records.  I objected at a hearing stating most of the records had nothing to do with my income.  The judge said that's just "typical language."  So, instead of just dealing with it, I went home and drafted a subpoena with the same language and upped the ante 25%.  I knew that when I filed it, it would fly like a bird because the judge had just ruled on something similar.  The information I gained from those 4 or 5 subpoenas was what changed the trajectory of my case.  ANYTHING that might lead to evidence is discoverable per Kansas law.  So, I guess what I'm saying is that if they want to play hardball, sometimes, you just need to roll up the sleeves.

It all depends on who you're dealing with and your own capability.  I had little to lose and anyone with a conscience should well understand that someone with very little to lose can be very dangerous.  Spend the time reading statutes, case law, court documents from other cases, and even listen to other cases.  You'll start to see some patterns.  I was able to go toe-to-toe with my opposition and in the end I won.  I didn't give an inch without a fight and the tide turned in my favor when I started doing that.  The battle can be won, but first you have to believe in yourself and start putting in the homework.

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Thank you BMull for your input!  I did not think that this was correct either.  There are quite a few things going on with this particular case that seem a little odd. 

The KS guidelines were set up for a reason and research was done in order to substantiate the amounts that are included in the tables for the different brackets.  Unfortunately if the judge (when a motion is filed) doesn't make counsel and opposing parties abide by these guidelines or allows them to pick and choose and use them inappropriately, it causes one parent to pay more than their share to the other parent.  In the end the only piece of the equation that suffers is the children.

More focus needs to be placed on making sure that the children are able to spend quality time with each parent, rather than how much money has to be paid monthly (then appealing that decision if changes are made).

Do you have any suggestions on how to handle an opposing party that continues to file motions, appeal hearing officer decisions and request attorney fees? 
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I have heard of cases like this where courts or case managers require a parent to provide direct expenses in addition to child support.  This practice is absolutely incorrect!  The child support tables in the guidelines provide for all direct and indirect expenses, less health care and child care.  Health care and child care are usually included on the worksheet so that parents automatically pay their income proportionate share, but it can be agreed outside of the worksheet.

The situation with direct expenses being included in the tables is documented in the meeting minutes and it is also further supported by case law many years ago.  In this case, yes, Mother should be covering all expenses for the children (including all expenses for sports) and this comes out of child support.

Remember that child support payments were never intended to fund 100% of a child's expenses.  This is only one parents's contribution.  Both parents have a financial obligation - that includes Mom.
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Kansas Child Support Guidelines / Ordered to Share Expenses but not Equal Residency
« Last post by jmw2019 on March 20, 2019, 04:15:38 PM »
We have a case where Mother has residential custody of the 3 children.  Father sees them every other weekend.  The child support that was originally figured is very confusing.  It appears that the normal sheet was utilized for calculations, but then the agreement in the decree also ordered sharing of some direct expenses.  This situation would not meet the criteria for Shared Expense formula to be used because they do not share equal or close to equal time.

  • Mother has advised that she is not sending clothes for the children and Father will need to supply clothing for them while they are at his house every other weekend (at 100%) - he has done so.
     
    2 Oldest Children play competitive sports and have league fees for Fall, Winter and Spring sports.  In addition they need clothing, supplies and equipment for these sports.  This is split 50/50.


    Originally they were also splitting daycare 50/50 for the youngest during the school year and all 3 during summer.

Father lives about 45 minutes from Mother so shared residency wouldn't work during the school year.  Shouldn't Mother be covering the above expenses by using the child support that is provided each month?  Or should those expenses be taken into consideration since they are paid by Father in excess of support
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General Discussions / Re: McPherson County??
« Last post by Guru on February 18, 2019, 10:20:06 PM »
At the end of the day, his support payments will be calculated into a total arrerage calculation.  He will eventually be required to pay you.  If you're still not receiving money, that's rather troubling.  There are plenty of folks that speculate the system is completely corrupt.
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General Discussions / Re: McPherson County??
« Last post by ksmom3 on February 18, 2019, 02:00:14 PM »
Thank you for that. I wonder if their way around that is because he doesnt actually see the judge. He comes in a few months in a row then they might skip a month or two then bring him back. But he only meets with the trustee in a room at a table never with the judge. When I had my case first transferred I found out about it and went in and I dont think the trustee appreciated that. He was like can I help you? This meeting is for him? But I've always gone when my case was in different counties. Its weird that that haven't brought him to the judge. The secretaries just say they are doing all they can and the judge won't do anything and I should go through the state.
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