Author Topic: 50/50 custody and child support amount? (Read 29280 times)

lovemykids · « **on:** December 20, 2012, 09:13:56 PM »

So my wife has a 5 month affair and confesses that to me 19 months ago. I forgive her and we move on with life.
In late Nov when I arrive home from work I am served papers for a divorce. In temp order I had to be out of house in 10 days and pay over 1900 in temp child support.
I have 2 wonderful children. One is 11 & the other is 14. They are more attached to me and want to stay with me more. In settlement negotiations we have agreed to 50/50 alternating weeks. but she wants to be primary with joint custody. In settlement she wants $800 month. I dont understand why. I did make $13,000 more than her but if we have 50/50 parent time why? I would think zero child support with splitting school and sports, etc. Can anyone verify if 800/month child support correct? We have been married round 15 years. She is also not agreeing to keep them in the same schools forever. although she says she has no intentions of removing them. Any help on vhild aupport vice would be appreciated. sorry. i am trying to do this from my phone. Thank you

KTM · « **Reply #1 on:** December 21, 2012, 09:34:08 AM »

Is that $800 in Child Support OR Spousal Maintenance/Support?

lovemykids · « **Reply #2 on:** December 21, 2012, 10:45:08 AM »

Thank you for the reply. That is $800 per month only child support total for my 2 children.
We have actually agreed to no spousal support maintenance.

I made roughly $13,000 more than her the past two years, but in the past she has made up to $10,000 more than me. If she gets a bonus that is when she makes the same or more than me. The past few years her company has not given bonuses due to economy, etc. I received a bonus but it is not that large and not guaranteed either. She has been with the same company for 20 years and I have been with the same for 18 years.
If parent time is 50/50, I just can't believe the law still allows for so much child support.
We both will buys clothes for them at our own houses, food, etc.
Seems like it should be no child support and then we split the school fees, lunches, sports, etc.

Thank you for any advice!

Guru · « **Reply #3 on:** December 25, 2012, 11:36:42 PM »

lovemykids, you should download the free calculator and type in the numbers. Regardless of how much more you made, it is all relative. If you made $13k more, but you both earned $150k, that's not a very large difference. If you both made nearer to $30k, that is a large difference.

50/50 or shared residential custody is a special situation which has been changing quite a bit over the past 5 years. There are plenty of posts here which list the detailed changes, but in a nutshell, support has actually decreased in 2012 from the previous 2008 order, but is still higher than what was always traditionally paid in shared residency cases. It may not seem fair, and many times it very well may not be fair, but right now that's what we have.

Your best bet is to use the calculator found here as a starting place, then let us know more details so we can help more. Who has traditionally paid for "direct expenses" is a very large factor in the amount of child support paid. Even if you bring home the bacon, if Mom always wrote the check for things, you'll probably end up cutting a larger child support check. You need a sharp attorney to help you, but you need to also know that some attorneys look at fathers who try to decrease child support as deadbeats. If you don't feel like you're going to get a fair shake, and you have some level of higher level education, you could represent yourself (pro se). But, in most cases, you should just pay an attorney.

lovemykids · « **Reply #4 on:** December 26, 2012, 02:54:26 PM »

I am trying to use the calculator but it is confusing for me. She made 58,100 and I made 71,100.
I have always supplied health care through my work over our 15 year marriage, but she wants to supply it now.
She says it will cost $400 month for the two kids in premiums for health care.
No daycare expense. I should get an equal time adjustment for 50/50 parent time alternating weeks.
Over the years we have had a joint checking and I have always wrote the checks for bills each month.
My children are ages 11 (12 in April) and 14 years old.

When I pay child support, does that mean she is required to pay all school fees sports, etc.?

Guru · « **Reply #5 on:** December 29, 2012, 02:46:00 PM »

PM me with your information and your email address and I will send you a sample worksheet so you can see where the values are supposed to go.

Guru · « **Reply #6 on:** December 29, 2012, 06:40:32 PM »

Here are two example worksheets. First one is if Mom pays direct expenses, other one is if Dad pays direct expenses. The rule for shared custody is that if the parent with the higher income also pays direct expenses, he/she gets a credit back for direct expenses. However, as the new Equal Parenting Time worksheet (EPT) states, the value cannot be negative. Which means Dad would essentially be out of pocket rather than doing what is right and Mom paying child support to Dad.

Anyhow, I hope this helps you get started with the worksheet so you can see how it is filled out. The $800 you mentioned previously is actually very close to what I got, but enforcement fees may vary slightly depending on county, so you need to make sure you change the enforcement fees section to match your county.

lovemykids · « **Reply #7 on:** December 29, 2012, 09:12:24 PM »

Thank you Guru! You figures are right in line. Makes much more sense. I really appreciate.
Still crazy with 50/50 parent time that the higher income parent has to pay.
In my opinion it should be that we split all medical, school fees, lunches, sports, etc.

My wifes lawyer said that I could pay health insurance if I want, I just have to prove what I pay in premiums.
I have always covered our children their entire life because premiums were always cheaper with my work and the plan is better.
The past few years I have changed from the HMO to a High deductible plan.
That is where you do not have a premium, but you withhold money from your check to a health savings account.
If you go to the doctor they bill my insurance company and the insurance company adjusts the price and bills me.
I pay 100% of the bill from the health savings account. Usually on around $65 normal visit and $122 for specialist.
I deduct $3500 a year. This year we have only used around $1000 for medical between the whole family.
So, they other $2500 is there for next year. But I am at risk of spending all $3500 a year for each child.
I did the first year with a surgery to one of our childs arms.
Once a child reaches $3500 in medical bills, they are free the remainder of the year.
Once the family reaches $7000 all medical bills are covered for the rest of the year.

So if I remove that $400 from her column for medical bills and keep my premium at $0 that makes me pay $555 a month in child support.
If I put in there that I withhold $200 a month in medical for the children that makes me pay $463 a month for child support.
My only concern there is that they will say there is no premium. so I would pay $555/month.
I would offer to pay 100% of medical bills. With her paying medical I would still have to pay 50% of copays, etc.

Any tips there?

Thank you again very much for the help and confirming the amount. Makes me feel better!!!!

Guru · « **Reply #8 on:** December 30, 2012, 12:19:44 AM »

I'm glad the example worksheets helped you. This website has been created to do exactly that - help others learn the in's and out's of child support. We always appreciate feedback on the tools/calculators/forms, as well as the information provided here (in general). It is definitely used to help others like yourself.

I can't be of too much assistance on the different types of medical coverage and payment as I'm not all too familiar with it, but a couple questions come to mind. 1) Where does the money, which you have deposited into your medical spending account, go at the end of the year if no one uses it? 2) If you have a paycheck stub showing you are depositing money into a medical account for your kids, is that not proof enough? If I am thinking of this plan correctly, the reason you have money withheld for this account is because it is tax-exempt, correct?

So, if you were to withhold $100, and you and your ex's portion of the medical care is $120, you would have to pay an additional $20, but that $20 would not be tax-exempt, so you have essentially paid more. Think about child support. Child support is not tax-exempt money for you. So it may be a tax benefit for you handle the healthcare. But, you have to be creative to determine the amount of credit. Obviously you want to aim high. So you can say that you'll withhold $400/mo for the kids (and you start off doing that), but if you find that $4,800/yr is not being used, you can reduce it, and if there ever comes a time, when its needed, you'll have to caugh it up. But, your child support has been adjusted already to account for the $400/mo. I hope that's somewhat a clear thought - I think your plan can work to your benefit it argued and managed correctly.

This is obviously a case where you and your ex need to exchange medical benefits information to best ascertain which plan would be the most cost effective. If your kids are not accident prone and are rarely sick, your plan may be best, but if this is not the case, your ex's plan may be more cost effective.

Here's a few more tips - the medical insurance you are responsible for is the difference between the single plan and the family plan for your ex. So if the single plan is $200, and the family plan is $400, you are only responsible for $200/mo, not the full $400. You are not paying for your ex's insurance. Also, any plan information or proof of payment needs to go both ways. Just because your ex's attorney says so, does not make it fact. You have the same right to see proof that your ex's medical plan premiums are exactly what she says they are. This is only fair to everyone.

KTM · « **Reply #9 on:** December 30, 2012, 11:23:52 AM »

I am familiar with this type of health plan.

In actuality, you pay $0 for the benefit of receiving negotiated rates on your medical costs and a maximum liability of $3,500.00.

If the children's mother covers the children under her insurance and she has premiums paid to the insurance company on a monthly basis than she would have the right, under the current laws and guidelines for Child Support, to list those premium costs on the Child Support worksheet. Under your plan you do not have that option.

If you & the children's mother agree that your insurance provides better coverage for the children than hers and you choose not to doubly insure the children. Both of you would enter a $0 premium paid in the Child Support worksheet. Than I suggest you ask the Court for a shared expense plan on medical expenditures for each child up to a maximum total liability equal to your deductible. Deductibles can be adjusted and are easily proven with documentation. So, I suggest not getting stuck with a specific number to be placed in the agreement.

Your Child support worksheet would show $0 for both of you as to medical insurance costs. A separate agreement would be filed with the Court or stated in the Court Orders "Journal Entry" from a Court hearing might look like this:

Father will provide medical and dental insurance coverage for the children.
Father will pay the medical provider the associated costs for medical treatment for the children.
Father will notify mother within 10 days of paying a bill for the total cost of paid for the children's medical care (Or you can say by the first day of each month).
Father will provide documentation of the statement of benefits for treatment by the insurance company, a copy of the bill(s) and proof of payment for the bill to mother by mail.
Mother will have 10 days to provide payment _____% of the children's medical expenses to father.
This agreement can be changed by mutual agreement in writing when filed with the District Court.

FYI - Actual % of shared medical expense can be negotiated and agreed between the two parties OR the Court may order t to be the same as your % of Child Support responsibility.

If you feel it is to the children's benefit to have double insurance coverage I would suggest you check with both insurance providers as to how that might work. A more complicated shared expense agreement would need to be drafted. I am not sure the insurance companies would allow the same expense to be considered by both unless they have a policy in place as to how they would handle that or unless the second plan were a supplemental insurance coverage plan.

Hope that helps you get this business behind you.

KTM · « **Reply #10 on:** December 30, 2012, 11:35:19 AM »

OOOPPPSSS!!!

Forgot this aspect of your insurance coverage.

If your company provides you benefit dollars toward the cost of benefits you select, including health care, those dollars would be included as a line item on your pay stub in your Gross income figures. There would then be an actual cost of the insurance benefits option you selected reflected as a deduction from Gross income on your pay stub. Your actual cost may be $0. But, the real cost is the amount of the deduction from your paycheck that is directly attributable to coverage for your dependent children.

That would place you in the position of needing to get documentation form the insurance company or your employer as to the difference between the cost of coverage for the adults and the cost of the whole family. The difference would then be the cost of medical insurance for your dependents that would be placed into the Child Support worksheet as indicated by GURU's statements.

An employer provided benefit is considered (added) when calculating your Gross taxable income each pay period. The cost of the benefit option you chose would then be deducted from your Gross earnings as a tax deductible benefit and not reflected as income in your net pay.

lovemykids · « **Reply #11 on:** December 30, 2012, 02:53:50 PM »

Thank you both for the information!!
Some answers to your questions.

Money that I do not use carries over to the next year. Since I only used around $1000 this year for medical bills but withheld $3500, that means I already have $2500 for medical bills in 2013. I can continue to take out another $3500 across all paychecks in 2013 or I could reduce it or increase it. But I am at risk of using all $3500 if a child needs surgery or something.

This money is tax exempt. So I am not sure if that means it lowers my gross income or not.

I agree with you both, if my wife wants to cover the medical I will ask her to prove that the $400/month is only for the kids.
I believe my insurance is still better and we have always put the kids on my insurance. They get a free physical each year, free required shots as they grow,etc.

On the other hand, as of now this plan does not have a premium. It does not mean that there will never be a premium.
Health insurance goes up every year.
I also know my company pays the insurance company a certain amount of money per person covered, but no charge to me.

I will check with my HR dept, but I am not sure if the non taxed medical money that I withhold into the health savings account counts towards the gross income.

Thank you both again for the information, tips and this great website!

lovemykids · « **Reply #12 on:** December 30, 2012, 09:49:23 PM »

One more question if I may.

I am learning how the equal parent time adjustment is working.

It seems it is half the difference of line F3. (basic child support obligation of both mother and father)
plus
It is 18% of D3.(Mother pays direct expenses)

My question:
What does "mother pay direct expenses mean"? Does that mean she pays all school fees, sports, etc.?

Thank you again!!!

lovemykids · « **Reply #13 on:** December 30, 2012, 11:17:43 PM »

I should also mention that the settlement agreement that has been proposed to me says . . .

Under custody
Both parties are fit and proper persons to have custody of the parties minor children and should be granted joint custody of said children.
1.) Wife, however shall be designated as the party to have primary placement of said children.

Under parenting plan (Joint legal and residential custody agreement)
2.) Father and mother agree that they shall mutually exercise the joint legal and residential custody, control and education of the minor children.

Parenting time is 50/50 alternating weeks.

Does this change how child support is figured for direct expenses?

Guru · « **Reply #14 on:** December 30, 2012, 11:53:54 PM »

You should definitely investigate the shared residency details for yourself further. You will find that regardless of the shared residency situation, the higher income parent always pays a some just because he/she makes more. Then, there are direct expenses. I'll let you research what these are exactly, but they constitute about 18% of the child support amount from the tables. This does indeed cover expenses for school, sports, etc. So to answer your question, the parent who is either ordered or is agreed to pay the DE in the case, is the one responsible to pay for these things.

You need to be a little cautious about the new "extraordinary expenses" section of the guidelines though. The guidelines were not well written in this regard, which could make a paying parent pay for sports twice if the judge isn't well read on the subject of child support.

Shared residency has changed quite a bit over the years. Prior to 2008, it was much much different. Parents were required to share all costs, which is probably what should happen. But parents took advantage and didn't pay their fair share. So the rest of the shared custodial parents have to suffer because of it. In 2008 the court ordered only a 20% CS reduction, which was complete BS, which many KS attorneys and parents know by now. In 2012, with the help of a few dedicated parents, the committee turned things around. The new method takes the pre 2008 numbers and tacks on DE. The percentages are probably still in need of a little adjustment to be more accurate, but most have agreed that the approach works much better than it did from 2008-2011.

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Author Topic: 50/50 custody and child support amount? (Read 29280 times)

lovemykids

50/50 custody and child support amount?

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